In this episode, Chris and Alisa Grace explore how to support a friend who is hurting—whether they’re grieving a loss, facing illness, walking through heartbreak, or feeling overwhelmed by life’s pressures. They discuss the importance of being present, listening without trying to fix the problem, validating a friend’s experience, and offering practical help in meaningful ways. Throughout the conversation, they share personal stories and real-life examples that highlight what helps—and what can unintentionally hurt—when someone is in pain.

This episode provides practical insights and relational tools to help you show up with empathy, compassion, and wisdom, offering real support rather than clichés or quick fixes. Whether you’re navigating relationships with friends, family members, roommates, or others in your life, this conversation will help you care for people well during difficult seasons.

Connect with Us:

• Website: https://cmr.biola.edu
• Facebook: https://facebook.com/biolacmr
• Instagram: https://instagram.com/biolacmr
• YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@biola-cmr

Join the Conversation:

• Subscribe to The Art of Relationships Podcast to never miss an episode.
• Leave a review on Apple Podcasts or Spotify to help others discover the show.
• Share this episode with someone who could benefit from these relationship insights.
• Sign up for weekly updates and resources from the Center for Marriage and Relationships:
• http://eepurl.com/bgsuQv

About the Hosts:

Chris Grace, Ph.D., and Alisa Grace are passionate about helping people build and sustain healthy relationships. As leaders of the Biola University Center for Marriage and Relationships, they combine the wisdom of Scripture with scholarly research to offer practical advice and relational insight. Learn more about their work at https://cmr.biola.edu

------------------

Alisa [00:00:00] Hey, when somebody you care about is hurting, maybe they're grieving a loss or facing illness, walking through a heartbreak, or maybe they are just feeling overwhelmed by the day-to-day stress of life. And it can be really hard to know what to do or to say. So in today's episode, we will explore how to show up well for a friend that's in pain. So we'll talk about emotional relational and spiritual tools that you need to offer real support, not just those quick fixes or cliches. So whether you've been there before or maybe you're walking through it right now, this conversation will give you some really practical ways to be present, to be empathetic, and it's grounded in truth and grace. So stay tuned, we're glad you joined us.

Mandy [00:00:49] Welcome to the Art of Relationships. This podcast is produced by the Biola University Center for Marriage and Relationships Let's get right into it.

Chris [00:01:00] Well, again, welcome to this podcast. Lisa, today we're going to talk about, as you said in the introduction, this idea of what do you do when you have somebody that you're a friend with and they're going through a tough time. How do you support them? How do come alongside them? Especially when they might be maybe avoiding people or even avoiding you or not even wanting to have hard conversations and.

Alisa [00:01:28] And I think this is such a timely topic, Chris, because it's not a matter of if, but when you're going to go through a hard time or your friends are going to through hard things. And so it's really great to be able to think about this, maybe get some tools in your relational tool belt, because there are some ways to really effectively reach out and support a friend that's hurting. And there can be some ways that are not as effective and can actually end up making the person feel worse. And I would say it's probably all of our biggest fear is we don't want to make it worse, right? So what do I say? So what about for you, what did you, in your mind, when you think about what it means to quote unquote be there for a friend, what is that for you? What does that look like?

Chris [00:02:14] Yeah, I think the first thing that comes to mind for me is that kind of simple phrase that be present when you're present. That is, when you are around someone that maybe is in need of support, one of the things that you can often find yourself doing is, I know I can, I can let my mind wander and I could be thinking of other things, or I can. I plan on sitting there quietly with them, but then I get distracted or maybe, you know, I think about other topics or something. So I guess the idea of be present, and I think that entails one other small thing, and I that means initiating and being there. I think one of the things that people may have a hard time with is, oh, they're not doing well. So we have a friend that has some health issues, and... I know when I went through health issues, it was those that initiated, even if I wasn't up for discussion or conversation or hanging out, it made me feel good that they initiated. So maybe when you initiate, you do it in a way that kind of gives them also the freedom to not necessarily have to discuss or talk about something. So those are a couple of things I'm thinking about. What about you?

Alisa [00:03:42] I love that. I think one of the ways being there really shows up for me are those friends that they remember from time to time, like conversation to conversation, interaction to interaction. They remember what I said. They remembered what I talked about. And So that takes some really active listening, intentional listening. And especially for, I think for people like me, a little bit of ADD, you know, can easily go in one ear, out the other, not in a, you now, dismissive way, but it's just not the way my brain is wired. And so I have to work at being super intentional, like after I meet with a friend or they've asked me to pray for something, I'll actually put it in my day timer. Like, this Friday, a family member has a really... Big emotional event going on in their life. And I know me, the day will get away from me and I'll be going 90 to nothing just doing life. And I won't remember off the top of my head. So one of the things I do is I actually put it in my day timer, a reminder to pray for this family member or pray for this friend or don't forget maybe the day before. And when I get that, as soon as I get that reminder, I will shoot off a text if I'm able to. Just, hey, I'm thinking about you, I know this event is coming up tomorrow, or this event is today, and I just want you to know I love you, and thinking about and I'm praying for you. And I might even include a Bible verse that I could be praying over them, or that the Lord has brought to mind that I can share that with them, how I'm pray for them. And so, just remembering from the last time we talked, you mentioned this, how's that going for you. You said this test was that you were waiting on results. Did you ever hear about it? So just remembering and following up can go a long way to being there for somebody.

Chris [00:05:51] Yeah, that's really good. And I think there's a lot of practical advice there, right? Write things down if you don't remember. Or at least have a text ready to go as soon as you visit with them, right. I think that that whole idea of taking the initiative, being present, allowing them the space if they need it when you do initiate, Um, but then also following back up. And then as you said, remembering the details, remembering the backstory, remembering the upcoming events that might be there, remembering some of the pain. Maybe another way, Lise, on top of that is to remember that you're probably not the expert who's going to solve their problem. And so that idea that you just said about listening, One of the things that we have to be able to remember is, most of us, most people are not therapists, right? You know, you're not trained in how to handle somebody who's anxious or depressed or sad or hurting or medical doctors who can diagnose or say, have you tried this or tried that? I think one of the thing that could be a negative and you want to avoid it is when you try to solve their problem. And I think um most of the time when I've been in that situation, I think. Uh, in fact, I've had to tell you a couple of times, least I'm going to tell you something. I don't want you to solve this thing. I just want to let you know. Uh, right.

Alisa [00:07:32] You just want to, I remember you saying, I just need to let you know what's going on with me, but I don't need you to fix it. Because the first thing I want to do is I love you. I want relieve you of pain or worry or burden. And what can I do to fix? Who can I call? What can, you know, whatever. But you're saying sometimes you just need me to listen.

Chris [00:07:55] Yeah, I think that's what it is. I think when we have a friend that is struggling in some way, they probably have an understanding of what's going on or at least know where it stems from. Not all the time, but enough to where you're probably not going to be able to add much to it as far as professional diagnoses. And so your job, I thing, in most cases, for friends, is just to show up, just to be there and just to listen, rather than to solve.

Alisa [00:08:29] I like that. So listening is not, doesn't mean you're trying to solve or fix the problem. What's another aspect of listening? Like I think part of being a really good listener to somebody is reflecting back what you hear them saying, kind of paraphrasing it. Maybe those last few words that they're saying is you repeat it back to them so that they know that you heard them. And so what I hear you saying is, and then you just kind of restate it.

Chris [00:09:04] Is that right? I think so. I think what you do is, you know, you ask, is this what you meant by that? And on top of maybe restating it, really I think you begin to pay attention to some of the emotional undercurrents and some of the emotional words that are used, right? If someone's like, well, I mean, and it just really, I was just so distressed when they say, what happens? What does that mean for you when you say distress like? What did that do for you? What were your thoughts at the time, and how would you describe distress? Give me another word for it. You know, and that helps them kind of maybe narrow down their use of, you know, maybe more deep or kind of descriptive, you now, emotional words that some of us don't use. We just say, I'm sad, Alex said, I am frustrated.

Alisa [00:09:55] I'm ticked off.

Chris [00:09:56] Yeah, and say, so yeah, I mean, I get that, like, when you get ticked off, what does that mean? Like, what do you feel? Like, you know, that kind of thing. And I think that's a way of parroting, rephrasing what they said, but also getting at clarity and also paying attention to those kind of key emotional buzzwords, right?

Alisa [00:10:18] So when somebody, when you do that well, when you paraphrase that bat, oftentimes in communication, a really key aspect of that is then validating their experience. Where you may not agree with it, you may identify with it. You may not understand it, but you can at least say, wow, that sounds like that was really tough for you. That sounds like you're really hurting or you're worried about. How that's gonna impact the people in your life or whatever it was that they were talking about, that you validate it instead of fixing, right? You just, you want to affirm their perspective is okay. Yeah. Right? And it might not be your perspective, might not how you would respond, but they are entitled to their perspective. They're entitled to the viewpoint and that's okay. That's okay, he said, wow. If I were in your shoes, I think I would feel the same way. I can totally see why you would feel that way. And it extends to the person, that sense of compassion, of empathy. Like, you really do get me when you do that for me. When someone does that for you, it's like, oh, thank you, I don't feel like I have to defend myself or my perspective or explain it away. It feels like you get me. And that's so freeing. When somebody can do that for you.

Chris [00:11:48] Yeah, it really is. I think validation plays that role of bonding and creating that empathy, right?

Alisa [00:11:55] Five years ago, when we were going through what we called our Year of Job, you were going through your cancer treatment, stage 3 colorectal cancer, tons of surgeries, doctor visits, our daughter was going through some severe health issues. I had some untied. It was crazy. It was just a horrible year, that Year of Jobe. What were some that was some of the things maybe that people might have said or done? Like you said, that wasn't helpful. So one you said was, when they try to fix it, what's something else that might not be helpful?

Chris [00:12:36] Yeah, going back to the, someone trying to fix it, uh, there were times I felt like a friend was, um, more interested in, in pushing their own personal beliefs. In this case, it was on neuropath, or on, what do you call it? Yeah, just the whole idea of homeopathic right cures And have I tried this and they say you don't even need to Sometimes go through, you know all the medical things like chemo and radiation, but instead And and I was then Forced into kind of go. Well, thanks. That's helpful And then they you know, I want to send you an article on this and it would be it's really good It would be really helpful It just felt like they weren't doing any of the things we just listed, right? They weren't talking about hearing me and empathizing and they were trying to solve everything. And, and on top of that, they were, uh, casting doubt on, you know, is on, oh, wait a minute, is this the right course of treatment I'm on? You know, other people have gone to foreign countries and gotten healed, you know on the black market with, you, know, whatever. And that that's one. I think another one that really was kind of maybe, I think it came into play when I was, you know, dealing with the after effects, let's say, of chemo. It does a lot, right? I mean, it changes so much. And I think there were some who thought, well, you just need to now begin walking more. And you need to and it wasn't let's say homeopathic per se but you need to change your lifestyle now and you and all of this tiredness that you're feeling dude have you really looked into you know what it means to exercise more and and if you can go swimming and if you can you know start the more you run and the more you exercise i'm like the only place i'm running is to the bathroom man ain't no way i'm going to around the block

Alisa [00:14:58] The beauty of colon surgery.

Chris [00:15:01] Right? And so I think that's why I think those are some of the things that I think were you know I think their hearts and and motors appear and that's where I had to land you know. I had to go out there they just want this to be over. They just want it to be healed and and then the other one I think that would I think sometimes when someone deals with something for a period of time, one of the things is... After, you know, a couple of months, it's like a whole lot of people were initially in contact, hey, praying for you, hey how's it going? And two, three, four, five months later, you just didn't hear as much from them or they never brought it up, you now, and this is something that's at the forefront of your thoughts, your heart, your emotions.

Alisa [00:15:56] Still dealing with after effects and somebody else may too.

Chris [00:16:01] And so to be recognized, you know, down the road I think would have been one thing I would recommend is kind of following up with those that have been through something. There's a friend here and a faculty member here at the university and his wife was going through the almost the same thing. Well what I noticed was every time I saw him on campus Um, we would, we would say, how are you doing? How's your wife? He'd say, how are you? Um, and it was interesting because we were on that same kind of journey. And so therefore we knew it, what was first in our hearts and our minds. And so sometimes people kind of maybe forget about it or they, you know,

Alisa [00:16:59] Hey, let's be real, Chris, right? We've all had moments where we thought, I wish somebody would just help me figure out this whole relationship thing.

Chris [00:17:07] And sometimes it's not even marriage, right? It just might be a roommate or a dating relationship, family, or even friendships.

Alisa [00:17:14] And that's exactly why we offer free relationship advice through the Center for Marriage and Relationships.

Chris [00:17:20] Yeah, it's not only free, but it's confidential, it biblical, it practical, and those who seek guidance early enough can often avoid huge problems later.

Alisa [00:17:30] Yeah. So if you're wrestling with something big or maybe there's just something small and you don't have to do it alone.

Chris [00:17:37] Yeah, I just know that you can connect with our team today, so just check the show notes for all the details. One thing that is kind of a little bit of a counter to the first point, which is, you know, trying to push off these homeopathic, there is also those that I know, you now, they did it with a good heart, but a positive side is, those that have gone through something similar or those that have felt pain in other areas or in other ways or struggle. It was that they also had, they could be a good resource at times. You know, it wasn't like you have, it's not like you had to turn away from this friend, every one of your thoughts when you come up here and you're trying to say, well, here's what you could do, here is what you should do. But if you know something about the area, if someone has gone through this and there's really good things that you've learned that have helped, it's really to share. So here's the best example. A lot of people make friends. When they struggle with those who struggle similarly, and they even have, you know, like in this one case, a Facebook group, all dedicated. And then people make friends out of those who have gone through similar things. And one of the cool things is they have access. Have you tried this or have you tried that? Or one of things I found, or there's this doctor, you know.

Alisa [00:19:09] So you're saying that if you've actually been through something really similar, it could be helpful. How do you figure out if it would be helpful or not? Or if that person is open to hearing or wants to hear, what do you say to somebody?

Chris [00:19:26] Yeah, well, one of the things I guess you could say, it's better, you know, to be a listener. It's better to be interested than it is to be the expert or to be interesting. Like, hey, I've been reading all these studies now about your, you now, migraines, and have you tried this? Have you done this? You know, I wish, you need to go check out this doctor. One of the thing you might wanna know and first find out is just where are they in that? Their journey is probably long and detailed, and they have a lot of things they've done. And they've probably looked into some of those things. So I guess it's maybe starting off by really, like we talked about before, listening, paying attention, hearing, asking good questions, and then, you know, kind of, like you said, acknowledging their journey. And then that, in some ways, will give you a little bit more. And then I guess another way, you just ask permission, say hey. If you're ever open to, you know, talking about this, or where are you on that? And you know I have an idea, or I've read something, and if you ever want to hear about it, I'd like to... Just let me know. Just let you know.

Alisa [00:20:38] That's really good. I like that. No, I like that. But one thing that came to mind in talking about maybe things to avoid, things that aren't helpful, is when if you're sharing about something that's that's going on in your life and they turn it around and make it all about them. Oh, yeah. Oh my sister went through that and then they start going through the whole detailed thing of their sister. Oh I know exactly how you next time. We're going to be Thank you so much for joining us, and we'll see y'all. And my similar, not really similar experience, da da da, da da. And then they go into all the details and then it's all become about them. And so you want to, you know, it's okay to say something about, wow, my sister went through something similar and I saw how much that impacted her. Tell me a little bit more about your journey. It's like you could briefly mention it, but then go back to them. If it's something about yourself, okay, yeah, I experienced something similar, But. But it's nowhere near what you're going through. Tell me a little bit more about where you're at. So you might mention it. Yes, I can relate. I can understand. Because there is something nice about knowing, oh, you know what it's like. OK, you get it. You've locked in those shoes. But then you want to pivot it right back to them. Don't dwell on your own story, your own experience, or somebody you know. Always turn it back to down. And asking those, you know, those probing questions, like you said, tell me a little bit more about that. Oh, that was a strong word you said just then. Tell me a bit more about that."

Chris [00:22:12] Yeah, no, I think that's really good. And, and it is one to avoid is when you use that as an opportunity to share all about yourself or the things that you've gone through that are very similar and attempt to make it the other person feel like, Oh, I know you, I get you. I understand you. I can see that. It's like, man, you have to be very careful because it kind of comes across. Well, it comes across as selfish and turn the focus back.

Alisa [00:22:42] I think that and also platitudes. Oh my goodness. You know, when someone shares something that they're going through that was really hard, the last thing you wanna do is spout off some platitude about, you know, God is just making you stronger. Or, now I had a friend who used to say this, but she would say it jokingly. And because we both knew it was a joke, it was okay for her to say that, but. That she used to always say, you know, God is making you into a pearl. And I was like, I hate the pearl. I don't want the pearl, but I mean, she could say that because I knew that she was teasing, but to say that and like, do you really mean it? And I don't know if you remember, but at some point, I think I was pregnant and I get really super sick during my pregnancies. Like for the whole nine months, I am green and throwing up. One of the most horrible experiences of my life, unfortunately, was all three of my pregnancies. And I remember a friend stopping by to visit and one of the things that she said to me was, well, at least you know it's not terminal. Oh my goodness, we've, I don't know, do you remember we went to a doctor appointment and the doctor was saying, well, it's not like you have brain cancer. Well, it is not like your gonna die. And it's like, oh really? You throw up your toenails for five months in a row, multiple times a day, and we'll see who's dying and who's not. You know, I almost wanna crawl over that desk and pounding and thank goodness you were there because you totally advocated for me. But those kind of things just are not helpful. The, well, you should. Phrases that start with, well you should, why don't you try, or.

Chris [00:24:36] You're lucky you

Alisa [00:24:37] Yeah, you're lucky it's not brain kids. Well, any kind of platitude like that, that God is really going to use this to allow you to minister to others. And it's like, yeah, he probably will at some point. But right now, in the middle of this hurt is not the time that I need you to remind me about that. So I appreciate your kind thoughts, but it's really not very helpful right now.

Chris [00:25:04] Yeah, so I think, you know, that this whole, you know, topic, how do we support, you know, that friend, you know, who's hurting? What do we do for them? Some practical things. Yeah, and I think we've hit a number of those, right? I think being the key, you know, being there, showing up, maybe even doing little things for them that you know maybe are now they're not able to do, right? Maybe even offering to do that little thing. Specifically. Yeah. And so, hey, is there anything that I can do? Is there anything I can help you with? Is there any need that you can meet? So I think being able to be there not just present-wise, being there as a listening here, right? Mm-hmm. Not. You know, being the one that's giving advice, nor platitudes. But there is a way to also turn this into not just, you know sitting there and listening, but there's behaviors that we can do and some things, right? You can reach out, and I remember, you know, people would ask you, or people ask me. And you know one of the silliest things was just simply trimming the tree, you know, something that I would always do, or you know every couple of, I don't know, seem like MUNS. You know, or just the little things I couldn't do, like get my Jeep fixed, you know? I couldn't put the top back on because I couldn get my hands to work. Well, it really was those that when they asked, you know, not a lot came to mind. Well, you can't come in here and help me do X, Y, and Z. That's for sure. But this kind of bugs me a little bit, that my, I can't put the, top up to my, in there. Within hours, you know, three, four guys were there doing that. And it was just, so, so I guess, um, for those that are wanting to help, it's, find out and ask what's, is there anything Dona can do? See, is anything I can, I can get you or I'm here.

Alisa [00:27:15] One thing I really have found helpful in that vein, because sometimes it can feel a little overwhelming. Is there anything I can do? It's like, oh man, where do I start? I've got like a laundry list right here I could give you, is to maybe offer some specifics. Hey, I'm going to the grocery store today. Do you need something from the grocery stores? Text your list to me, I'll pick it up, and you can just Venmo me back, okay? I can go to the, can I pick up something at the dry cleaners for you? Can I get your kids at school? Can I pick them up for you this week? Hey, I would love to bring dinner over for you guys. Is there a good time? Is there one of the nights this week or next week that's better for you or hey, can we set up a meal train for you. Can I come and clean your house? Oh my goodness. You know, that year of Joe between you... And me and our daughter that were having the health issues. We have multiple doctor appointments every week, at least five or six a week for a year. It was overwhelming just keeping up the mental load of that. And my friends were like, they didn't ask me. My really close friends, they came over and they said, we're clean in your house. When are you guys gonna be out at your doctor appointment, we are clean in you house. We came home from doctor appointments and there would be a whole meal sitting on our front porch. And one of the things I've loved about that practical help like that you touched on it just a while ago Chris you were saying You know a lot of people will be there in the immediate need But then they kind of drop off and I think that year because it was extended and even went Longer than that year of actual treatment. Yeah, the recovery period I would say we're still in it five years later But one of the things that was so meaningful were those friends that kind of dripped small acts of kindnesses throughout the whole year. It was, we would get a gift card in the mail. We would get, you know, flowers on the front porch. There would be a card. But there were several ways that they just dripped those kindnesses over a long period of time.

Chris [00:29:34] No, I love that. And as we get ready to wrap this up, please, I think there's a couple of things that are really important for those when you're trying to help this friend out. Maybe just one last piece of advice, if you're the one that's wanting to know, how can I help this person? Open your learning opportunities about what's going on So that... If the person needs something. Like, for example, it could be, you know, if you're a friend of a college student and they're struggling with, you now, maybe thoughts of depression or suicide, you know where you can help them go to. You go do some research. We had friends who come here, four friends, to our center saying, I've got a friend. I don't know if they'll ever come here. But they really need to talk about and processed our relationship therein. Is this a good list for them? And now if that person ever says, gosh, where can I go? They have some things that they can share that are helpful. That's one way to also just be able to have some things in the tool box and be able to share as needed and if it does, come on.

Alisa [00:30:58] You don't have to do it perfectly. We're not gonna do it, perfectly. I'm not a doctor. You're not a pastor. We're no experts on most everything outside of our little circle, right? Even in our little little circle we may not necessarily be experts, but I think it's most important just to remember to show up. Just be present, be available and with a listening ear Ready to pitch in wherever you can. And to be ready to go the distance with your friends.

Chris [00:31:32] And on top of that, I would just simply say, know your limits, know where you are. No longer the export limits. And if they start exceeding what you can do, you know, and what, and you're like, man, I don't know how to help that. And rather than trying force it, you just kind of be ready to admit, okay, buddy, I'm here with you, I'll help you, but I think we need to go to a professional right there. Well, a lot of this, Lisa, is great, great practical advice, and we'll just be remiss to mention a bit, perhaps the biggest thing, and that's prayer for them, right? It's constant, consistent, bringing them before the Lord, your friend, and then asking the the loving Creator God who knows all things and knows us thoroughly to be with that person and to keep them at the fore of lifting them up to our heavenly father. Yeah, absolutely. Well.

Alisa [00:32:37] Thanks for that thought. That was awesome. Well, we're gonna wrap up today. This is the art of relationships. We're so glad you joined us because we know you could be doing a ton of other things, but we're really glad that you're with us. We are a part of the Talbot School of Theology. And if you would like more information on building and maintaining healthy Christ-centered relationships, check out our website at cmr.biola.edu. And Chris, we'll see you next time.

Chris [00:33:05] We'll see you next time.

Mandy [00:33:09] We're very glad you joined us for today's podcast. For more resources on marriage and healthy relationships, please visit our website at cmr.biola.edu. We'll see you next time on The Art of Relationships.