In this episode, Chris and Alisa Grace explore the do’s and don’ts of breaking up well. They discuss how to end a relationship with honesty, kindness, and maturity, while avoiding common mistakes like ghosting, giving false hope, or staying in unhealthy contact after the breakup. They also share practical guidance for navigating the emotional aftermath, processing grief, and seeking God's wisdom throughout the process.

Whether you're considering a breakup, recovering from one, or supporting someone who is, this episode offers biblical encouragement and practical tools to help you move forward in a healthy way.

Want advice on your breakup? We can help! cmr.biola.edu/resources/relationship-advice

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About the Hosts:

Chris Grace, Ph.D., and Alisa Grace are passionate about helping people build and sustain healthy relationships. As leaders of the Biola University Center for Marriage and Relationships, they combine the wisdom of Scripture with scholarly research to offer practical advice and insights. Learn more about their work at cmr.biola.edu.

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So breakups are never easy, and that's whether you're the one ending it or the one being left. But how you navigate a breakup says a lot about your emotional maturity, your respect for the other person, even your trust in God's timing. So in this episode, we're going to unpack the do's and don'ts of breaking up well, how to end things with honesty and compassion, what to avoid, and how to process the aftermath in a healthy, faith-filled way. So whether you're considering a breakup or you're in the middle of one or you're still healing from one, this episode will give you the biblical and relational wisdom you need. So stay tuned for the Art of Relationships. Welcome to the Art of Relationships. This podcast is produced by the Biola University Center for Marriage and Relationships. Let's get right into it. Well, welcome to another Art of Relationships podcast. Yeah, welcome. Co-host here, Elisa and Chris, uh co-host, I guess. Um, you know, Lisa, I think uh when we were dating, one of the things that was awesome, uh I think was we got along so well. We didn't have a long dating period. No. Um, and we avoided something that causes so much kind of turmoil for some people, and that is when they realize they're with the wrong person. Right. Right? Or they aren't in a good place. They're not ready. Yeah. And and that leads to some breakups. And so as you introduce this, there's some do's and don'ts, right? If you're going to handle a breakup well or do a breakup well, or in that you're kind of thinking and processing, is this the right relationship for me? Yeah. What do you think? Are there some things, yeah, that you've been thinking about with this? Yeah. Well, you know, I think one of the first things that we just need to acknowledge, the elephant in the room, is that a breakup is gonna hurt. It's a there's no way that you can do it that completely saves the other person heartache or you know, pain. Yeah, and that's just one of the risks that you take when you enter a relationship is that they can be messy, they can be painful, but it's one of the risks you take when you enter in that kind of romantic relationship. Yeah, and even other relationships, right? I mean, like I I had to break up with the Lakers one time. I I loved them and and and I just I don't know, I just didn't like the direction they were going. And I thought, I'm gonna break up for just a little bit. It was messy, it was painful, it was hard. You're still not over the I'm I'm I'm I'm doing better. You're carrying the pain. I see it in your face. I'm carrying a little bit of the pain. Um breakups. Wow. Yeah, I I I you know, here's where we get to talk to, not just kind of about some good psychological principles, which we'll share, right? Uh but but also communication and also just from experience, right? It's happened to probably everybody. I I mean Did any girl ever break up with you? I think you're the breakup king. You broke the hearts, but did it like seriously, did any girl ever break up with you? I'm sure there's one out there that will re not remind me, but I don't know. I d I don't really. Okay, so if you ever dated Chris Grace in your life and broke up with him, we want to hear from you. Oh, we want to do it. We want the deeds right away. No, we don't. Um, yeah, you know, one of the first things that comes to mind, you you you talked about, you know, it's kind of messy in the pain, is the things that we can do during that time can make it worse, the things we do or don't do. Right. Right. I mean, today we people use terms like ghosted, right? In casual dating relationships, sometimes, I mean, you know, I guess the first thing to avoid is ghosting the other person. What do you think? Oh, yeah. That's that's it's it's an immature response. And if that's your go-to response, then you're probably not emotionally and developmentally mature enough to be in a relationship in the first place. Yeah, that's so you owe the person to acknowledge it and to and to say something. Um, okay, what let's talk about owing. What what do you owe in a casual dating relationship? Let's define that, right? You've been on anywhere from three dates to maybe casually, maybe maybe a few months. Yeah. Right. And and so now maybe even, I don't know, six months. Uh maybe not. Let's just say four months. I don't know. In that kind of setting, um, you maybe haven't defined the relationship as serious, but you're together, you're dating. Right. One of the things to avoid then is ghosting. Another one seems to be lease is at least being there i in person. I I mean, I guess you could do it if you only dated four, five, six times, you know, to by text, but it probably is something you want to do in person. Would you agree? I would definitely say do it in person. Yeah. And you don't want to do it in a really public area. Yeah. Because it could be, you know, it could be embarrassing for the person if they have a a deep emotional response, even if it's just been a couple of months. Yeah, so avoid maybe going into, you know, a busy place or touring in the cafeteria or yeah. So maybe pick a private place, maybe in their home, their apartment, you know, just someplace where you can have some privacy. Uh you know, there was somebody who who was wanting to end a relationship, came in and and asked me this question. They said, um, I just hesitate breaking up because I don't want to hurt them. Uh I know they'll see us. And I so therefore I've been putting it off. Yeah. I think it's kind of messed up a little bit, right? I tried to encourage you. Look, it's probably, yeah, it's gonna hurt. Like, man, that band-aid, if you take it slowly and peel it, you're like, I feel every millimeter of this. Yeah, you're gonna just rip the band-aid out. Do you every time? Would you rec I mean it's probably not good to go real slow and say, hey, let's take a weekend break. Hey, let's and it kind of gives false hope, wouldn't you say? Oh, I would definitely say that. And I think if you've been, you know, you've given it enough thought and prayer and consideration, you don't want to keep putting it off because the longer you're you're just putting off the inevitable. Yeah. And the longer you stay in that relationship, the harder it's gonna be for that other person. So there's no, you know, it's going to hurt a little, it's gonna hurt a lot. That's option A or option B. There is no option C where the other person is not gonna be hurt. So it's better just to address it and be forthright about it, but you want to do it with kindness. We'll we'll do the do's in a minute, but yeah, you don't want to keep putting it off. You want to address it, get it out there. Yeah, I I think this was an issue for me. I you know, I I think in in a in a in a couple before I met you, you know, in college, there were a few relationships I was in, right? That I knew it wasn't going to last or or was that the right relationship, yeah, probably within the first month or two. But I ended up staying in a relationship and I kind of regret one where I I we just we had different kind of personalities, uh, you know, and and there was one situation where I I you know I kind of saw some flashes of anger and something else. I'm like, yeah, I don't know. Well, all that to say, I I kind of it was right around Christmas, and I remember staying in the relationship through Christmas because I just didn't want to cause, you know, like over the break. And at least I I I just think I didn't handle that well. I think your advice is it should have been addressed as close as possible to when those doubts came in, and then be I I didn't have to sit there and explain my whole psychology as to why, right? I mean, you don't have to go into all detail, but I at least could have said, look, I just feel like we're heading in different places, you know, there's a little bit of difference, and but I didn't. I held on. And I think that that probably hurt more because it was it like created at first I thought, oh, I'll just take a break, but kind of created false hope. Something else you don't want to do, is it? That's right. Yeah, I think that's definitely right. And I think also uh you don't want to once you've made that break and you've you've voiced that decision that you know you're an awesome person, but I think we're just going in different directions, like you said. Yeah. Um you don't want to continue to maintain contact with them and being in conversation with them. And that includes texting, direct messaging, phone conversations, meetups. Because I think like what you said, Chris, it just gives them false hope. It just continues the and puts off the inevitable break. And so to make it very clear, concise, and and and really clean. Yeah. So you're you're not staying in constant contact. So and sometimes it's not possible. I mean, if if you're in the same, you know, cult neighborhood culture, you know, university, college, dorm, cafeteria. But but but you could still, you know, be clear and avoid the texting, which is usually the case, or if they're posing or sliding in their DMs, right? Or, you know, avoid, you know, commenting on posts. And and I think that just helps the other person also recognize this is a clean break and I need to move on. Yeah. Well, Lisa, there are some do's, right? Those are some don'ts. Any other don'ts, or you want to go into the do's if you're casual. I think one one other important one, and you kind of touched on that, is that it's if you're in the same geographical location, you go to the same school, you go to the same church, you're in the same clothes, it may be inevitable that you're gonna run into them, and you don't want to just, you know, go out of your way to avoid them, but you don't want to get into a prolonged conversation either. You want to be polite, you want to acknowledge them. Hi, it's nice to see you, and then go on. Yeah. What do you think? Well, I no, I I thought that's great. And I I I remember a situation at a university I was at recently, and um they I don't know if they both agreed to break up or not, but when the other one, when one of these persons saw the other one, you could tell they were still hurt and didn't like it. But the way they responded, if you're the one that's broken up with, you know, if if it you aren't, you know, the one who initiated this, this person did, I think, the wrong thing. That they would they would put on a false sense of, oh hi, how good to see you, but then they would kind of start flirting with the next of the opposite sex who was ever near them. And it turned out, because I talked to them, they were doing it to make the other person jealous. And so it was kind of a bad response of, you know what and and the other person saw it like, oh well, it's just weird. And but it it was done out of hurt, and that was those are some things if it happens to you, you know, be gracious, be kind, go, oh, okay, I'm at least you may have been broken up with, I don't know, but it's hard and it hurts. But you gonna have to, you know, still be civil and you know, or not do anything under, you know, and texting at midnight, you know, and trying to get back. Uh, you know, those are things to avoid. Well, the ways to do it then would be as you said, you you you can go quickly and explain why, you know, they deserve that, right? Hey, I just and and I do you want to avoid also saying it's all me, not you, right? I mean, you know, it's like, oh, I need to break up because I'm in the wrong place, it's me, right? It's not you. I I just have to get my head straight. You're great, I love you, and but I I'm not there. Yeah, okay, it's a little bit of a comp out, right? Sometimes it might be, and there might be legitimate reasons why you need therapy. But it also might just be better for you to just be prepared to say something to the extent of, well, look, I just I'm sorry, I just feel like we're going in different directions. I'm I'm, you know, taking some time off from dating, and I and I just feel like it would be better for me and us, and I don't want to lead down false hope. And I'm just that's where I'm at emotionally, and and you don't have to go into detail, right? Yeah, in fact, I think it's probably better not to go into a whole lot of detail. And if this is a casual dating situation, might be a little different in a serious dating relationship, but we'll talk about that next. But in the casual, I think you're right. I think, you know, just just to keep it really kind of short and concise, one of the things that you can say to avoid that, it's not you, it's me kind of thing, is to say, you know, it's I'm just not feeling the romantic connection that I was hoping to, or it seems like we're going in different directions. You're awesome, you're a great person, and I've really appreciated getting to know you, but I think we're just not a good match. You're awesome, I'm awesome, but we're just not a good match. You shared with me uh after I met you that you did that with the guy, and you knew it wasn't a great match when he came over and said to you, Hey, uh your date, let's go bowling. And you went, Oh, okay. And he goes, Oh, you have your bowling ball, and you go, Yeah, let me go get it in my room. You were just being sarcastically. And he goes, Oh, good, I got mine in the trunk. And and that wasn't the only thing. There, I mean, it wasn't the bowling perception. Not to say that if you have a bowling ball, that that's a bad thing. No, it wasn't. But it was in this case. No, you also had some other things. I remember you having to have that conversation. Hey, yeah, and and you know, he I remember even after we started dating a little bit, he came back by one time just out of the blue to show up. Well, you were there visiting. Yeah, that's right. I you were back there in the game room working on wedding invitations. Is that right? And he came I don't know if we were that far along, but you were there at the house that last time he stopped by. That's messed. And I think I showed him my engagement ring. Yeah. It's like he's not been seen in over 38 years. Uh I I'm not responsible. He was just five. He was fine. Yeah. Um, so but I think we covered enough of the do's and don'ts of casual, right? I mean, you accept, you do that. Let's let's any other do's or don'ts that you would say for someone in a in a casual dating breakup situation? Well, no, I think it just to summarize it is you want to be clear, you want to be concise, and you want to be kind. Cool, those are three great C words. Clear, concise, and kind with a K. Kind with a K. Kind with a K. Okay, uh now let's let's up the Annie a little bit here. You've been dating somebody, it's a little bit more serious. Um there have been at the love, maybe words exchange, you know, but a little bit more, you know, of a romantic attraction, but something went wrong, something changed. Um that this one's a little bit harder. It's clear that you're not gonna break this, you know, break up on tax, and it's clear you're gonna do it in person and it's clear in private. So all those same things apply, right? Um, are you owed a little bit more because you've been dating longer? And I think the answer is yes, right. I mean, hold on. I I've been getting to know you and and we've both invested in this. Invested in this, and so it might take like you said, the context has to be right, the situation where you're at, how you're doing it. Yeah, how do you keep that other person um from being, you know, there they might be caught off completely off guard. Yeah. And I think you might want to say, listen, I've been doing a lot of thinking and praying about our relationship. Could we have a talk? And could we visit? I don't want to freak you out, you know, but could we this Friday night, you know, um, just find a quiet place? Because I I just want to process some things with you. Is that kind of a good way? What do you think? Yeah, I think that's a really good way to start that conversation. And I think even like let's take a step back from that, even before we start that conversation, before we initiate it. I, you know, is this is something that is just my mantra that you'll notice on this podcast, is that I'm going to encourage you to pray. Pray, pray, pray before you even initiate that conversation, asking for the Lord to confirm or lead in a different direction, if you know, if he has a different idea, just surrendering this relationship to the Lord and being willing to hold it loosely. But it's so important, I think, to uh to approach it from a posture of prayer because that gets your own heart right before you go into this. Lord, I want to go in and into this conversation, even though it's hard. I want to go into it with a heart posture of I don't want to hurt this person, but Lord, I want to honor them, even though this is going to be a hard conversation. I, you know, they're they're a nice person and and it's just not a good match for us. I've sensed that from you, Lord, but I need you to prepare my heart, Lord, to speak of if from Ephesians, to speak the truth, Lord. Help me to be honest and forthright and clear, but to be kind at the same time. You know, Lord, just produce more of that fruit from Galatians, the fruit of your spirit. Help me to be kind, help me to be gentle, uh, help me to um uh exhibit self-control if this starts to go south for any reason. Lord, all I can do is have you prepare my heart. What do you think about that? No, I know I yeah, boy, that's that's exactly it. I mean, that's how you start. You can't you really don't want to go in there unarmed or or unprepared with the Lord. And you know, even thinking about that, Chris, is to even acknowledge that there could be an aspect of spiritual warfare in this. You know, one of the reasons I keep putting it off could be because I'm doing it out of disobedience to the Lord. And that's a that's a spiritual issue and my issue with the Lord. And it could be something going on with the other person in spiritual warfare. And so you you want to pray for protection. You want to pray for protection of the other person's heart. Hey, friends, we have got some big news. The Center for Marriage and Relationships is now part of Talbot School of Theology, right here at Viola University. We're thrilled, Lisa, with that because Talbot's been equipping leaders uh, you know, in biblical truth for decades. And uh now together we get to expand our resources for marriages and relationships. Yeah, it's exciting because research shows that couples with ongoing support and biblical guidance are far more likely to thrive. And that's exactly what makes this partnership possible. Yeah. So if you're a student, pastor, just hungry to grow, we want you to know this is only the beginning of what God is doing through Telbut and the CMR. Yeah, you can learn more. Just check out the show notes for details. Okay, so one of the things that could happen, Lisa, probably more cases than not, I would bet that's that that's what's happening. And it's because one of the persons has went, you know what? I'm just not sensing this relationship because there's a sin issue, or because there's something in your behavior or my behavior or our behavior that really isn't bringing God glory, and and the enemy could use that. So no, man, I would say clearly you need to take a moment and pray for the spiritual protection that you said. You know, if if you're if you ever find yourself on the receiving end of this, you you probably can't prepare, but you've probably got a little bit going on, some signs, something's going on, right? In many situations, I I think if you are on the receiving end, there's no way to prepare. You're seeing signs, right? You probably are feeling that there's something you're getting it, and you're or you know, you know, they're dealing with something, or you're dealing with something, and uh, but it could still be you, you know, you could be gobsmacked and and uh freeze and not know what to do. And you it's really hard to prepare for that. So we don't really have a whole lot. I don't have a lot to do. So you just kind of go with it and go, all right, Lord, I trust you in this situation, and this is hard. I'll I'll take it. One of the things you don't want to do is probably you know start getting so emotional, you know, in front of them that and try and change their mind. Or because I think that could that would be a natural tendency, right? If if you were to break up and be like, what, why, what's going on? No, we've got something. I can change. I can change, and and there's probably a lot of pleading, and I think you have to be, as you said, you know, concise, clear, kind, but you also have to kind of stand by this decision. You have to stick to it. Yeah, and stick to it. And I I I would think too that if you're the one doing the breaking up, that you probably have had some conversations about this at some point, like some conflict. Yeah, this conflict, this situation, it's not just. It shouldn't surprise you, but and then I think at least that's when you explain it and and they're owed a a little bit of your thinking more than if it's a casual dating, right? They're they're owed that. And you'd be need to be prepared to answer questions. Yeah. Go ahead. Oh, I th I think in being prepared to answer their questions. Part of uh I think the wisdom of what you're saying at being prepared is that you need to mentally clarify in your own mind what the issues are. Why is this not working out from my perspective? What needs are not being met, what values are misaligned, and then uh, you know, just having clarity in your own mind going in. Yeah. Well i uh you would recommend and I would too, Psalm 139, either verses 1, 2, 3, 4, or even 23 and 24, right? You need to go in and say, search me, oh God, know my heart, try me and know my anxious thoughts, see if there's a hurtful way in me, and then leave me in the everlasting way. And you go away for a while. I mean, this needs to be something you've been thinking and processing, because it's gonna be, you know, pretty radical as far as now I'm losing what was kind of a part of me, or we had a future, and that future is now not going to be. And and and you want to do it for the reasons, right, that you say sense, and then you stick with those and you commit them to the Lord. Like, no, Lord, I'm gonna commit to you. Don't be wishy-washy. Well, maybe we can just make a a break. Let's just take a break for a while, and that's just it's just delaying the inevitable. Makes sense. Yeah, Nick. So those are some do's and don'ts together, right? I I I I remember in one, I was very convinced, you know, convinced what I needed to do, needed to take the break, but was clear, concise, had the conversation, did it all, you know. I thought the right way and in the right place. The person was, I could tell, not agreeing and not happy. Sure. Pretty much kind of like slammed the door emotionally, right? And and everything else. Um I I think that's maybe how they dealt a little bit with the herd. It was hard. I ran, I remember it was emotional. Like I didn't want to break up, but I knew we, you know, didn't need to. I think the don't came in was I was prepared to cut off all contact, and then it turned out she wasn't. And I kind of let that contact go on, or I responded to it, right? And I I I I knew that it would, it was kind of like a last, I don't know, effort to try and keep us together or have me change my mind. And and I didn't do it, I I did okay, but I sometimes gave in a little bit, right? Okay, well, let's just go get coffee and talk some more one day. I just wished I wouldn't have done that. It would have been a much cleaner break. Yeah after everything was explained and talked about, and my reasons were there, and I committed it to the Lord. I probably messed up when I agree to, you know, see them socially or you know, go to church, you know, and like uh that's tough because you gotta separate out now. Two lives that have kind of started intersecting in church and school and everything. It's like, but all my friends are here. What would you do, Lisa, if your friends are all together and you have the same friends and you go to the same church? I mean, that's hard. That's a tough one. When you date within your friend group, yeah, that's really risky because if you break up, you could risk dividing the whole group or being left out of the group because they go with your other partner, or the other person might get left out. Yeah. It can be awkward. So, what do you do? You just have to prepare ahead of time, knowing I may need to radically change some of what I do, right? But you stay committed to it if you know it's the right thing. Right. But you gotta face the fact that this may not be easy. Yeah. And it may involve me changing my lifestyle a little bit. Where I go, where I where I go to church, who I hang around with for a little while. Yeah. That can be that can make it even harder in the breakup. And so, like when you've gone through that breakup, there's there's a recovery process. Yeah. Because even if you're the one that's done the breaking up, it can be hard. You could I time and again, we've had people come in for counseling about a breakup. Yeah. And having, after you know, a couple of weeks, it's like, wow, I'm starting to have some doubts. Maybe I was too hasty. Uh, you know, gosh, I really miss some. I miss, you know, they were they have really good qualities. It's normal to have those days. Exactly. And so while breaking up is hard, yeah, the aftermath can oftentimes even harder. And so one of the questions that I counsel uh someone who's having those regrets or those second thoughts is to ask yourself, are you missing your ex-boyfriend? Are you or are you missing having a boyfriend? That's a good clarified. Do you miss Rebecca or do you miss having a Rebecca in your life? Because when you can answer that, that's gonna bring some clarity that either I'm responding this way because I've that person, maybe I need to take a look again, or it's really because I'm lonely and my heart furts. No, that's a great thing to answer and and know, especially during those first few days of doubts, right? And loneliness. Even the first couple of months, I think. Yeah, it can take a bio taking. It can. And you know, I I remember breaking up with the musical group, you know, the Dixie Chicks. Yeah, I liked them, and all of a sudden they just weren't dead. They blew it. And they and I just didn't appreciate it. And so I'm uh you hear their song on the radio, like, oh yeah, and I went, wait, I broke up with you. And it was hard to, you know, keep them out of your life. And yeah, I just had to change stations and you change your playlist. Change my playlist. That's messed up. So, okay, so now, you know, getting back to the the the kind of do's and don'ts, especially in that kind of relationship. Now, by the way, if it's very serious, you're engaged, and now you're talking, let's let's go. We we pr you might want to go ahead and bring in a counselor at this point when when it gets to that point, right? We're not talking about after marriage, right? This is breaking up during a casual or a serious dating, not at the point of engagement. That's a little bit different. We won't cover that, but you probably want to bring in some more people to help you. But there are so some things you can learn from this, at least. Um, and some lessons about, you know, how do I treat others? How would I want to be treated? You know, if the rules were reversed. Um, you know, it and honestly, if the other person was feeling this, I I would want them to say it. I, you know, it wouldn't want to be a long, hurtful, you know, couple of weeks and months, right? And one thing you don't want to do is you want to avoid uh rebound dating. So don't get back in the pool right away. You know, you want to give yourself permission and time to grieve, to process that loss. Yeah. And what is it, Lord, that you have for me in this experience? Yes. By the way, I I just want to say I love it when you use, you know, uh sports analogies. You know, rebound dating is like, I just, you know, I missed that. Well, I'm gonna grab this rebound and go right back, right? Yeah. And that doesn't mean you can't find that next person right away, but yeah, probably, as you're saying, might take some emotional checking your heart. Yeah, and you might want to do some processing, even you know, if it's substantial with a therapist, this is a great time to do some introspection to to consider why did I choose that person that turned out not to be a good match for me? What was attractive about that? What can I avoid next time? Maybe, Lord, is there something in me that needs healing? Something that I need to pay attention to and maybe process through with someone else. Yeah. What do you think? No, I think that's right. I mean, it could be a you know, it could be a friend, it could be, you certainly don't want to do it with that person, right? But you you you can find a friend or uh, you know, maybe someone who's trained, if especially if the longer it goes on. Yeah. And I think another thing uh to do after a breakup in this recovery process is to two different kinds of investment. Invest uh time well, maybe three. You invest in yourself, figuring out why did I choose this person? Where do I want to grow? What kind of person am I looking for? Yeah. You want to and take the time to invest in your friendships. Maybe you made the mistake of really cladding down your friends and going all in with this person you're dating and you've alienated yourself, but you really need to mimic this and go back and reconnect and get involved with those friends. Yeah, that could tell you too. If you're in a dating relationship now and it's going well, hey, be careful. Avoid cutting off everybody because they're going to be important to you and maybe come more important. And then I think a third investment is one that you did really well just prior, I think, to where when you and I met. Sure. The investing in your relationship with God. Yeah. This is a time to maybe pull back from dating. And it's something that we call a dating sabbatical, which is what you did. So why don't you tell our viewers, our listeners a little bit what's a dating sabbatical and what did you do during that? Yeah, it's a term most people familiar with, right? Sabbaticals, you know, in academia, you take time off, you know, a year to study and do something else other than what you're normally doing, or concentrate on one thing. Or in the church, you know, you can hear about people taking, you know, times of sabbatical in the Bible. It talks about, you know, keeping the field from harvesting every seven years, right? You need to take a year to let the land heal. Well, so yeah, so I took that principle and other people had done it as well, and just thought, you know, a couple of relationships here, uh, you know, they were okay. One was not so okay. But I learned a lot about myself and others, but but I knew that in the middle of a relationship, I wasn't able to really see and figure out something. So I just decided, you know what, I need a break. And be right before I met you, I had just come off a one-year sabbatical from dating. And I had just decided I needed to do this. And I I would go casually with people, I would, you know, hang out and we would go do things, you know, in groups, but I wasn't going to date a person um for one year. So didn't you take some like pointed special time to really focus on your relationship with the Lord? Oh, well, that was the whole point. Yeah, that was it. At least it was not just to, you know, leave the grand grand ground fellow, but you know, to actually spend that one year going, Lord, you and me need to I need to figure out some things with you. I need to spend more time with you. I need to be prepared to be alone. I need to be okay with living my life with just you. And as soon as I kind of grasp that, like, Lord, I just want you. I just need you. Just teach me, show me. And that year was so powerful in going, wow, okay. I've been kind of thinking I've always had to need somebody, but I don't. I just need to find contentment, joy, excitement in him, in the Lord. Uh, and that meant, you know, a lot of disciplines that had kind of slacked off for me. You know, I'd only been a Christian four years, but it's like, yeah, I forgot a lot about some of these things and worked on that. And you know, what's funny is once you and I met, it was those qualities that you're talking about that you were really uh pointedly cultivating with the Lord during that year that was so attractive to me. I mean, your beautiful brown eyes, your rugged good lips, of course, that didn't hurt at all. We don't even need to talk about that. It's just so obvious. But the but it was your heart, really. I mean, the the the beauty, the handsomeness, the good life, that can only take you so far. That's right. That can only last so long because it's so surface. But it was your heart for the Lord and that you challenged me in my relationship with the Lord to keep up with you. And it's like, wow, I really like this guy. And I think that's the same for me, at least. There was a solid core there of your love for Jesus, your contentment in him, and knowing, God, I'm with you. I don't need a man, you know, I need Jesus, and you stuck with him and you loved him. And I think that was both attractive. So it's the final thing that we'll say, and that is if you're about ready to end a relationship because of spiritual differences like that, know how important that is because that's carried us now for what, 75 years of marriage, right? Of knowing that you love and and I'm gonna encourage you a relationship with God and with Jesus first and foremost, same you with me. And that's the foundation of a good, healthy marriage. And if you don't have that in a casual or serious dating relationship, then it probably is from the Lord that wait, well, I need to get something straight here and we need to figure this out. And and uh anyway, those are some things that I hope you guys enjoyed, Lisa about talking about the do's and don'ts of breaking up and you may have to go through a breakup, but it doesn't have to break you. And it can actually bring a lot of really healthy introspection and growth if you approach it from that perspective and that mental, emotional, spiritual framework. Well, thanks, Lee. Close this out here. So well, I tell you what, if you want more information uh like you're getting here on the podcast, check out our other episodes on our website at cmr.biola.edu. Uh we're on all sorts of platforms Apple, iTunes, Spotify, you check it out. But share this episode with a friend that you know needs to hear it. And we would love for you to subscribe, give us a rating, gosh, five stars. That would be awesome. Suddenly, suddenly give us 20 stars. We're very glad you joined us for today's podcast. For more resources on marriage and healthy relationships, please visit our website at cmr.biola.edu. We'll see you next time on the art of relationships.